Renboy Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 Those are old school. New systems have dedicated LPG injectors (you have to drill holes into the intake manifold), and use a piggyback ecu that gets tuned separate from the gasoline tune. One guy has it and lost a total of 0hp and 5lbs of torque with this setup. And another benefit to dual fuel rather than the old dedicated LPG systems is you can still run a top end cleaner through the system if/when you want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
///BHRpowered Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 pay for itself how the fuck do you figure that with decreased mpg, dirtier engines, poor performance, and all the labor involved? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renboy Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 pay for itself how the fuck do you figure that with decreased mpg, dirtier engines, poor performance, and all the labor involved? Cost - $2000 mpg loss - ~10% LPG - cleaner than gasoline (by far), why do you think only battery operated and lpg run fork lifts are allowed to be used indoors? Use some sense. performance loss - 1% (if that) labour involved - included in price quoted above. Now, savings - ~50% per fill-up. If you can't do that math...well, it wouldn't be you if you could do the math. For someone that keeps pushing octane, you really are a hypocrite. LPG has octane in the 108-110 range (depending where you buy it) which means you can really push the timing on the engine, or level of boost, or compression ratio. It is far superior to gasoline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ing-schu@online.no Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 If you can't do that math...well, it wouldn't be you if you could do the math. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginph Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 pay for itself how the fuck do you figure that with decreased mpg, dirtier engines, poor performance, and all the labor involved? Cost - $2000 mpg loss - ~10% LPG - cleaner than gasoline (by far), why do you think only battery operated and lpg run fork lifts are allowed to be used indoors? Use some sense. performance loss - 1% (if that) labour involved - included in price quoted above. Now, savings - ~50% per fill-up. If you can't do that math...well, it wouldn't be you if you could do the math. For someone that keeps pushing octane, you really are a hypocrite. LPG has octane in the 108-110 range (depending where you buy it) which means you can really push the timing on the engine, or level of boost, or compression ratio. It is far superior to gasoline. How about LPG stations in CA? In EU its denser than gas. In here none, and CNG well one station per semi large city, sucks. Ren I dont know the whole story but they say LPG dissolves magnesium. I think some cars (eg. mazda3) has magnesium in the valves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troutman Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 I recently took out a loan so I could convert my Holden (Chevy 5.7 LS1) to LPG. Cost is A$5200 which I know sounds ridiculous, but I get $2000 rebate from the government. It is the latest liquid injection set-up which includes a special fuel pump and so on. It is a dual fuel set-up which from memory starts the car on petrol. Power on LPG apparently increases by about 5-15 rwkw due to the higher octane which should result in over 200 rwkw in my case, and torque is up across the board too. Fuel economy loss is claimed at only 8%. LPG here costs as little as 1/3rd the price of petrol. Install will be done within a few weeks and I'll post back the results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
///BHRpowered Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 so let me get this straight, its costing you 2000 dollars to decrease your MPG, to run a fuel that your engine doesn't like, and that you actively have to seek out, combined with the fact in most states you can't even pump your own lpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renboy Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 pay for itself how the fuck do you figure that with decreased mpg, dirtier engines, poor performance, and all the labor involved? Cost - $2000 mpg loss - ~10% LPG - cleaner than gasoline (by far), why do you think only battery operated and lpg run fork lifts are allowed to be used indoors? Use some sense. performance loss - 1% (if that) labour involved - included in price quoted above. Now, savings - ~50% per fill-up. If you can't do that math...well, it wouldn't be you if you could do the math. For someone that keeps pushing octane, you really are a hypocrite. LPG has octane in the 108-110 range (depending where you buy it) which means you can really push the timing on the engine, or level of boost, or compression ratio. It is far superior to gasoline. How about LPG stations in CA? In EU its denser than gas. In here none, and CNG well one station per semi large city, sucks. Ren I dont know the whole story but they say LPG dissolves magnesium. I think some cars (eg. mazda3) has magnesium in the valves. Saint, I did a quick search and couldn't find anything that says propane destroys/effects magnesium. Not to say it doesn't, just that I couldn't find support or didn't understand what I was reading (<-very posssible). I don't see how they could use magnesium for valves though. Magnesium + fire = very bright light + very hot fire. The valves would burn up almost instantly. Not to mention, the new mazda3 is hideous. It's unbelieveable that they could make some minor changes and completely fuck a car up. It looks like real life japanimation. I'd sooner walk than drive that car. As for LPG stations, where do you get your barbque tanks filled? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renboy Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 so let me get this straight, its costing you 2000 dollars to decrease your MPG, to run a fuel that your engine doesn't like, and that you actively have to seek out, combined with the fact in most states you can't even pump your own lpg Apparently I was correct regarding your math skills. Propane burns cleaner and doesn't wash oil off cylinder walls like gas, so your engine actually prefers LPG. LPG is common enough, here. And why would I want to pump my own gas? Canada + winter = effin cold. Not to mention, here the douce bags in office decided pumping gas was a hazard for stupid people so they slowed the flow down in the pumps (takes longer to pump gas), and they removed the pump locks so you have to stand there with your hand on the pump. I generally jam my gas cap in there so it keeps pumping, but if they can see that you've done this, they stop the pump from inside the station...dickheads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troutman Posted June 27, 2009 Report Share Posted June 27, 2009 In Australia almost all taxis run on LPG and it's available almost everywhere. The one advantage of dual fuel is you can use a jerry can as a worst case scenario to refuel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginph Posted June 27, 2009 Report Share Posted June 27, 2009 When I was learning to drive on an LPG car, it was just dieing on a hill. I asked the instructor what the fuck is going on (I floored) he said we are out of LPG. I switched the button and continue on gasoline Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginph Posted June 27, 2009 Report Share Posted June 27, 2009 Saint, I did a quick search and couldn't find anything that says propane destroys/effects magnesium. Not to say it doesn't, just that I couldn't find support or didn't understand what I was reading (<-very posssible). I don't see how they could use magnesium for valves though. Magnesium + fire = very bright light + very hot fire. The valves would burn up almost instantly. Not to mention, the new mazda3 is hideous. It's unbelieveable that they could make some minor changes and completely fuck a car up. It looks like real life japanimation. I'd sooner walk than drive that car. As for LPG stations, where do you get your barbque tanks filled? We use charcoal here Read on for valve problems. I know Mazda3 guys suffered from that problem. It might be possible to cope with some additives. http://www.carkeys.co.uk/features/technical/637.asp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renboy Posted June 27, 2009 Report Share Posted June 27, 2009 The problems seem to be with Honda's, Toyota's, Jag's, and Ford's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troutman Posted June 28, 2009 Report Share Posted June 28, 2009 Under bonnet temperatures are higher with LPG. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
latinopikachu Posted June 28, 2009 Report Share Posted June 28, 2009 and god knows we need a hotter MCE compartment... it's hot as fuck as it is Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginph Posted June 28, 2009 Report Share Posted June 28, 2009 and god knows we need a hotter MCE compartment... it's hot as fuck as it is Water wetter is a must then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
///BHRpowered Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 I have used the royal purple version before, it does indeed stay slightly cooler, along with keeping the temp in check more at high speed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troutman Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 Got the car back finally. All seems as per specs, with a good install and smooth performance. However, I'm not convinced it goes harder on LPG, nor that the godawful whine from the fuel pump is normal. I will await further updates before recommending such a set-up to others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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